In 1991 Billy and Akaisha Kaderli retired at the age
of 38. Now, into their 3rd decade of this
financially independent lifestyle, they invite you
to take advantage of their wisdom and experience.
with Kevin and Erin Knox
We met Kevin and Erin Knox
Mexico and have known them for several years. We
interviewed them previously and met up
with them again in Jaibalito,
Atitlan, Guatemala. Since retirement life is not static, we asked if they would do a follow up
Q&A for our Readers. It's fun to see how people adapt to challenges and
create the lifestyle of their choice.
All of us at Ven Aca
Restaurant, Jaibalito, Guatemala
has it been since you left the conventional working world?
left full-time employment to train as a massage therapist in 2000.
left my job as vice president and coffee buyer for Allegro Coffee in 2002, and
have done occasional consulting work since.
REL: Do you
consider yourself retired or semi-retired?
K&E: Well, we
hope we’re just semi-retired! Erin has had massage clients everywhere
we’ve lived. I’ve done a bit of coffee consulting and have hopes of partnering
with a really nice local guy in a coffee roasting business, but it’ll be very
REL: You have
moved quite a bit during the last several years. Where do you consider home to
a doubt we’ve moved way too much! There are a number of reasons for this, but a
lot of it is that the places we are drawn to tend to be culturally rich,
beautiful and popular (and thus expensive!) small college towns such as Boulder,
Colorado or Ashland, Oregon which are well outside our means.
We’ve lived in Colorado longer than anyplace else in our married lives, so it
probably feels the most like home to us, but we’ve moved enough to know that
anyplace we live where we have a few close friends and an opportunity to
contribute can feel like home very quickly.
Summer (!) in Anacortes, WA
REL: Do you
recommend living overseas to other people looking for retirement destinations or
do you believe that one can find a frugal and satisfying lifestyle in the
K&E: It seems
to us that full-time expat life is always going to appeal to only a small number
of retirees. Ties to friends and family are strong for most folks, and of course
as screwed up as the U.S. health care system is, it does start to provide a
safety net of sorts once Medicare kicks in.
said, there’s a lot to recommend either full-time or “snow bird” expat life,
especially in established expat enclaves in such places as
Panama. One can live a comfortable middle-class lifestyle in these places on
social security only or the equivalent income, while in the U.S. one would have
to choose a very low-cost area, most likely live in a mobile home or shared
housing situation, and would always (as we are ourselves) have to be watching
the U.S. health care cost situation.
aside, there’s so much to be said for experiencing other cultures while one is
relatively able-bodied and adventurous.
REL: Have you
changed your portfolio much over the years? What is your strategy? What is your
belief about the future of the markets?
read at least 40 books on investing, talked to numerous financial advisors and
spent thousands of hours researching online, and the learning process continues
every day. We are both savers by nature (investing, let alone speculating,
doesn’t really come naturally) and have long been searching for the frugal early
retiree’s “holy grail” of a portfolio that returns 6-10% a year with few if any
years with negative total returns.
We moved from a plain vanilla 60%/40% stock and bond index fund allocation in
our early years to a much more complex small cap and value tilted slice-and-dice
approach of what backtesting told us were “uncorrelated” asset classes - all of
which tanked in unison (~23% paper losses) during the 2008 financial crisis.
Chez Mobile living room,
Canon City, Colorado
a wake-up call to do further research, and we’ve been allocated to a variation
of Harry Browne’s “Permanent Portfolio” ever since. It’s a great approach, but
there are any number of simple portfolios that seem to us to make nearly equal
sense, from owning 100% Vanguard Wellesley fund to a 50:50 Total Stock Market
and 5 Year U.S. Treasury approach. And of course we wish we had the nerves of
steel that you two and other savvy stock market investors have, but we’ve
learned through seeing what we actually do (and think about doing) during market
crises that we’re pretty conservative investors by nature. As our time horizon
gets shorter, the old Will Rogers saying comes to mind more and more often: “I’m
more concerned with the return of my principal than the return on
the future of the markets, the fourth of Harry Browne’s essential 16 Rules
for Financial Safety comes to mind: “no one can predict the future.” We try
to invest accordingly!
REL: What do
you do about healthcare? Do you find satisfying healthcare outside the U.S.?
with health care and insurance has certainly been one of the biggest unexpected
challenges of early retirement, and paying out-of-pocket for health insurance in
particular had been one of the biggest drivers of our decision to live full-time
in Mexico for several years, where one can easily afford to self-insure and pay
for routine care out-of-pocket.
Currently we’re paying just over $100 a month total for an excellent Silver plan
under the Affordable Care Act here in Colorado. Our low taxable income gets us
subsidies of over $800 a month, which is great for us, but in our view the fact
that the cost of health insurance for a relatively young (51 and 58) couple
taking no prescription meds is $100 per month says a lot about just how broken
the U.S. system is. Given that fact and the huge disagreements in Congress about
health care we keep our footprint here in the U.S. light and our options open.
We feel that we have to be prepared to return to Mexico or another affordable
locale in a matter of weeks at anytime given how up in the air and complex U.S.
health care and insurance is.
The Flatirons, Boulder,
had a fair amount of experience getting routine as well as some emergency health
care in Mexico as well as lesser amounts in
Thailand, India and elsewhere and
across the board much prefer it to the best we’ve experienced in the U.S. -
including when we both had deluxe company-sponsored insurance and long-term
family doctors. In these other countries you simply call the doctor (including
specialists) you want to see and see them within a day or two - no paperwork, no
nurses and no being rushed like cattle through a 10 minute appointment. Instead
the doctor spends whatever time is required, giving you their full attention,
and then gives you their home and cell phones for follow-up!
The problem, as you
well know, is that regular access to that kind of care really spoils you. For
our part we will certainly make the minimum use of U.S. health care even with
insurance and will look forward to seeing our dentist during winter visits to
REL: What has
been your greatest challenge in retirement?
building friendships of equivalent depth to those I had in my years in specialty
coffee, a business I was (and am) very passionate about.
Although I love to travel, we have lived too many places trying to find “the
right fit.” With time we have both come to realize that each place has its
plusses and minuses, and each place has wonderful people.
back, would you have done anything differently?
things! We both would certainly have stuck it out in the corporate world and
saved a lot more had we anticipated health care costs remaining out of control.
We’d also have gotten much savvier about investing and expense tracking
before “pulling the plug” on full-time work.
REL: Do you
have any regrets about leaving the conventional working world?
Kevin: Yes. I hadn’t planned on my last corporate job being my last job in
coffee, but changes in the business landscape combined with the ’07- 08 financial
crisis and my failure to save enough to open a place of my own have limited me
to consulting work, which really isn’t my forte.
REL: Do you
own or rent a home these days?
K&E: We own a
modest but comfortable late-model mobile home in Cañon City, Colorado. We have
less than 20K invested in it and pay $245 a month in space rent, so it’s very
affordable living in a quiet place that we can also “lock and leave” anytime for
travel without worry.
REL: Do you
own a car?
K&E: We own a
used Scion XA, one of famed finance blogger Mr. Money Mustache’s
Top Ten Cars for Smart
It’s inexpensive, gets great gas mileage, is cheap to insure, and it sits in the
carport a lot since we both have bicycles and live less than 2 miles from the
things we do everyday. We fill the 10 gallon tank once or twice a month.
Near Silver City, New
REL: If you
could live anywhere, where would it be?
Kevin: The little town of Nyons in Southern France from May through September and Santa
Barbara the rest of the year.
Erin: Nyons and where I am right now, with frequent visits to the Pacific Northwest to
see friends and family. Okay, having a little cabin on one of the San Juan
Islands would be nice too!
REL: Do you
still consider travel to be part of your retirement lifestyle? Where do you plan
on going next?
K&E: We do
love to travel but have learned through trial and error that we aren’t cut out
to be perpetual travelers. We’d still like to do at least one more lengthy (3-5
month) stint in Thailand and other parts of Southeast Asia, and it’s also on our
long-term wish list to return to Italy and France, probably our two favorite
countries, when and if the dollar and euro are close to parity and we feel like
we can justify the airfare.
Otherwise our travel these days is either to see Erin’s family in the Pacific
Northwest or for meditation retreats. We also do plan on spending 2- 4 months
each winter living inexpensively in Mexico.
REL: Do you
have a valuable travel tip to share?
this is going to sound like shameless shilling, but seriously: spend a lot of
Retire Early Lifetsyle,
buy the ebooks there and learn from the best! But we really have learned more
about how to travel and how to live frugally from you two than anyone else, and
we’ve read a ton!
from that, buying one-way tickets so you have flexibility (the change fees on
international flights these days are often 50-75% of a return fare!), booking
only 2- 3 nights of hotel in advance and then looking locally for value-priced
accommodation that won’t be advertised on the internet and always looking for
local expat web forums (and of course real live local expats) to learn from are
a few tips.
piece of advice would you give to those who are looking to retire?
all you can about investing and joyous frugal living from sites such as yours,
Mr. Money Mustache and Darrow Kirkpatrick’s “Can I Retire Yet” site. If you have
a spouse or partner, make sure you are both on the same page about priorities
and that you both have strong friendships outside of work that nurture you.
Retire Early Lifestyle would like to thank Kevin and Erin for their time in
answering all these many questions, and for their willingness to share their
lives with our Readers. Thanks Kevin and Erin!!
About the Authors
Billy and Akaisha Kaderli are
recognized retirement experts and internationally published authors on topics of
finance and world travel. With the wealth of information they share on their
they have been helping people achieve their own retirement dreams since 1991.
They wrote the popular books,
The Adventurer’s Guide to Early Retirement and
Your Retirement Dream IS Possible.
information about financial independence and travel, visit our